Sorry this thread is a bit out of date, and I can't find one for 2013 and it's a bit late to start one now.
I have seed from one of the Exchanges of wild collected Clintonia uniflora and would welcome advice on when to sow and cultivation generally please.
(Moderator note: I've started a new thread, David, I hope successfully! How about let's include "late 2013" in with the 2014 thread? Lori)
David, I have sown seeds of different Clintonias at once when I get them and store the pots either in a cold frame or outside during the winter. Usually they germinate the first spring or sometimes the second.
Here they like a shady (but not dark) woodland setting.
Many thanks Trond.
The first germination is always exciting!
Ligularia soldanella started germinating Jan. 21, after 9 days at room temperature.
What a pleasure to start seeds from Alplains, with excellent and accurate seed starting instructions right there on the packet! I grew this years ago and planted a couple out - one overwintered and emerged, never to be seen again. If you scroll down to the bottom of this link, you'll see it's worth another try:
Edraianthus graminifolius 'Alba' - first sprout on Jan. 23 after 11 days at room temperature.
Convolvulus tragacanthoides - first sprout after 13 days at room temperature.
Acantholimon alatavicum - first sprout after 4 days at room temperature.
Wow, that's an amazing Convolvulus. Looks like its growing in a desert-like region in China.
The seeds I'm growing from it were collected by M. Holubec in Kyrgyzstan, from either Kyzyl Tu, Terski AT, ("semi-desert steppe") or Kyzyl Ompul, Kyrgyz AT ("2200 m, rocky slope").
When you say "at room temperature" ?
Do you mean under lights? as well?
"At room temperature" means just that and once things start to germinate, the fluorescent lights are turned on. (I just put a thermometer under the lights among the trays and it does indeed show 70 deg F. :-) )
Also, I would normally add if there had been some treatment prior to germination, e.g. stratification (and for how long) or scarification. So, to be clear, the seeds that have just germinated are easy ones that just need moisture and a little warmth.
Three Lilium species, all hypogeal germinators.
Planted at 65-70F. When I saw no germination at 25 days, I move them to 60F. They began germinating almost immediately.
Lilium martagon var. cattaniae
Very nice, Rick! That was an initial 25 days at a cold temperature, right?
I'm trying Lilium lophophorum... probably pointlessly, oh well. I have planted them and have them in the cold room. Any advice would be appreciated.
A few more eager beavers over the last couple of days:
Eritrichium aretioides - germination after 13 days at room temperature. (Again, excellent documentation from Alplains.)
Aster batangensis - germination after 4 days at room temperature
Aster vvedenskyi - germination after 5 days at room temperature
Gypsophila cerastioides - germination after 7 days at room temperature; I'm starting over with this one, as somehow the old plants that I moved have never regained vigour (probably due to broken tap roots, I suppose?)
Astragalus coccineus - germination in 4 days at room temperature after scarification. (NB. I do realize that germinating this species is easy - it's growing it that's hard! Here's one more try... )
Very nice, Rick! That was an initial 25 days at a cold temperature, right?[/quote]
No. They have always been in warm (65-70F to start). It's hard to know for sure that the lowering to 60F did the trick, or if they were ready to sprout anyway. I have other lily seeds in the same regime with no germination yet. I don't think that there are any Lilium spp. that actually germinate in the 40F ( 4C) range. Although, many do require such a temp for some time before and/or after germination.
[quote]I'm trying Lilium lophophorum... probably pointlessly, oh well. I have planted them and have them in the cold room. Any advice would be appreciated.[/quote]
I tried some 3 year old lophophorum seed from NARGS seedex last season. No luck, but there was only one or two seeds with detectable embryos. I am going to try again this year with seed harvested in 2013 from two sources. From what I read, they would like your general regime to germinate in, but to keep them going they apparently prefer cooler temps (60F-15C). Also important to keep them drier once germinated. Not exactly sure what that translates to.
No. They have always been in warm (65-70F to start). It's hard to know for sure that the lowering to 60F did the trick, or if they were ready to sprout anyway.
I'd suspect they were likely about to sprout anyway... ? I find it very hard to imagine that plants could reproduce by seed in nature if they really depended for germination on such minimal and timely temperature differences. Seems like a strategy that would destine them to rapid extinction, but what do I know.
Thank you for the info on Lilium lophophorum. Only a couple of the seeds did not contain embryos so that's a start, anyway.
More germination today:
Echinops cf. nana - germination after 6 days at room temperature
Aster limonifolium - germination after 6 days at room temperature
Aster alpinus ssp. dolomiticus - germination after 8 days at room temperature
Lotus mearnsii - germination in 6 days at room temperature after scarifying
Stanleya pinnata - germination after 6 days at room temperature
Codonopsis cf. alpina - germination after 8 days at room temperature
Ah, these easy ones are satisfying! (Good thing too... Looking at all those lifeless pots/failed attempts at the end of the seed-starting season is always a bit of a downer. ;-) )
A couple more today:
Erigeron linearis - germination after 9 days at room temperature
Onobrychis montana - germination after 2 days at room temperature, following scarification.
Edit: Here are seeds, as received on right, and with the prickly seed coats removed on left, prior to being scarified on the file shown in the photo:
And the resulting seedling... looks like I didn't scarify them too effectively, as I've only got one seedling so far:
The Onobrychis is this year's winner for fastest germination, so far!
Oxytropis campanulata - germination in 3 days at room temperature after scarifying
Edit to add photo:
Erigeron humilis - germination in 3 days at room temperature
Astragalus ceramicus v. filifolius - germination in 9 days after scarifying
Silene jenissensis - germination in 9 days at room temperature. (I bought a plant by this name some time ago... very invasive and I'm still pulling out the odd shoot. I assume that this source from Alplains will be different - that is, a desirable plant for the rock garden and correctly-named, assuming that the invasive one was an imposter.)
Edit to add photo:
Plantago nivalis - germination in 9 days at room temperature
Convolvulus nitidus - germination in 8 days at room temperature after scarifying
Gentiana kyrilovii - germination in 6 days at room temperature after overnight soak in GA-3 solution
Hyoscamus pusilis - seeds germinated in ~30 days at room temperature; seeds collected by V. Houbec at Ketmen, Kazakhstan.
Dracocephalum botryoides - seeds germinated in 6 days at room temperature:
Michauxia campanuloides - germinated at room temperature.
Ononis rotundifolia - germinated in 6 days at room temperature after scarifying.
Trifolium macrocephalum - germinated in 7 days at room temperature after scarifying.
Astragalus amphioxys ssp. vespertina - germinated in a few days at room temperature after scarifying.
Xylorhiza venusta - cold room for 4 weeks, as per Alplains instructions; germination in 4 days after being brought out to room temperature.
Plantago nivalis - germination in 9 days at room temperature.
Convolvulus nitidus - germination in 8 days at room temperature after scarification. (Thanks for both the seeds and the germination advice, Stephanie!)
Erigeron linearis - germination in 9 days at room temperature.
Erysimum wheeleri - cold room for 4 weeks as per Alplains instructions; germinaton in 4 days after being brought out to room temperature.
Gentiana kyrilovii - soaked in GA-3 solution overnight, then germinated after 6-7 days at room temperature; seeds collected by V. Holubec at Chong Kemin, Kungei AT, Kyrgyzstan.
Andryala agardhii - germinated at room temperature in 15 days.
Erigeron humilis - germination after 4 days at room temperature.
Colobanthus subulatus - germinated at room temperature.
Campanula crenulata - abundant germination in coldroom after 28 days; seeds collected by V. Holubec, in Haizi Shan, Sechuan, China.
Androsace spinulifera - abundant sprouting in coldroom after 28 days.
Wonderful, and incredibly useful information Lori, across numerous Genera. I really must follow your lead and start to record more information. . I do it religiously for my Fritillaria, but the other Genera I don't. You've made me realise that I'm just discarding very useful, easily recorded information. [ must try harder!]
Seems like a posting issue occurred, as the pictures for Androsace spinulifera and Campanula crenulata are the same.
Thanks, Ron. I do try to keep records, for my own interest, and in case it's useful to anyone else. Funny, with all the time I spend on it, I still wind up with a few mysteries every year. Seems the gremlins always delete a line or two out of my spreadsheet somewhere along the way!
Oops, yes, thanks for the sharp eye - I've corrected the photos now, and gone back and added a couple to the older posting.
[quote=Longma]Wonderful, and incredibly useful information Lori[/quote]
This is why I make a plea every year, both here and the SRGC: for complete (or at least useful) records. Pictures are fantastic, but they don't tell the story of germination.
I've been recording usable information for a few years now (mostly from NARGS and SRGC forum) and adding it to a data base of Dr. Deno's work. So far, I have over 550 added entries in the "Other Sources" column. Lori is by far the most prolific contributor. (She is footnote #3.) Thanks, Lori!!!
Germinations so far 2014. Will try to enter all in this post.
Thanks Lori & Tingly
Editor note: OT = outside
Wow, you are really going to town, Sharon!
Among the many very desirable things you're growing, it was interesting to see that Linum dolomiticum germinated at room temperature for you... I usually stratify flax, but I wonder if it's always really necessary? What does "OT" stand for?
Did you end up having to type it all in, or were you able to copy and paste?
Quite a few lovelies there, Sharon!
And the Gentiana bhutanica didn't require any GA3?
Lori, I was surprised to find the Linum dolmiticum germinating so fast as it was intended to have OT or outside treatment. The seed pot experienced fluctuating temperatures in my greenhouse of 32C down to 1C last September in a period of 7 days. So I suppose the seeds got the alternating temperatures needed and germinated quickly. I estimated the germination was near 20C on the 12th day. BTW I did leave the pot of seedlings outside perchance they would survive the winter. Any germination results with -4C - +4C x weeks or OT are rescued pots from my unheated greenhouse for faster germination under lights.
The solution to copy and paste was using Google Chrome! Next I'll learn how to edit.
Rick, no GA-3 used on Gentiana bhutanica! But I just found Gentiana aff septemfida, a white hybrid, has germinated at 20C in 9 days after 4 hour GA-3 seed soak! They are now in a cold basement under lights to grow on cool. As for Meconopsis aculeata, once it hits the summer humidity here out in the garden it may be short lived.
I would suspect that G. bhutanica may be one of the gentians that needs no pretreatment at all, given the very brief period of chilling before it started germinating. For example, G. tibetica also sprouts at room temperaure without pretreatment.
By the way, looks like the current name for G. bhutanica is G. vernayi, according to The Plant List. An annual. Can't find any photos of it:
Allium meteoricum - emerged in 20 days at 65F. One seed out of 15..
Allium sikkimense - emerged in 23 days at 65F.
Cerastium candidissimum - emerged in 7 days at 65F.
Erigeron compositus Mt. Adams Dwarf - emerged in 11 days at 65F. One month old. 2cm wide from tip to tip.
Scutellaria alpina - planted 9 April 2013-no sprouting so put in fridge 10 June 2013, and forgot about it. Sprouted in fridge 15 Feb 2014.
Interesting that those alliums germinated without stratification.
That particular batch of Scutellaria must take the record for the longest time to germinate! A happy ending though.
Here's a seedling update:
Aconitum rotundifolium - Holubec seeds from Kyrgyzstan (Chong Kemin, Kungei AT); seeds were stratified 6 weeks in the cold room and started germinating in the cold/dark.
Astragalus ceramicus v. filifolius - Alplains seeds from Colorado; germinated in 3 days at room temperature after scarification. They are looking very "filifolius" indeed.
Silene chungtienensis - started germinating after 10 days at room temperature.
Artemisia filifolia - Alplains seed from Colorado; germinated in 21 days at room temperature.
Linum suffruticosum ssp. salsoloides 'Nanum' - NARGS seedex; stratified, started germinating in the cold/dark at 26 days.
Andryala angardhii - Piatek seed; germinated in 15 days at room temperature.
Gypsophila cerastioides - germinated in 7 days at room temperature.
Convolvulus nitidus - germinated in 12 days at room temperature after scarifying; leaves are starting to get silvery.
Ornithogalum nanum - stratified; started germinating in the cold/dark at 9 weeks.
Inula rhizocephala - seeds from Holubec (Kazakhstan, Ketmen); germinated in 23 days at room temperature.
Silene jenissensis - Alplains seed; germinated in 9 days at room temperature.
Xylorhiza venusta - Alplains seed from Utah; stratified for 4 weeks, then germinated after 4 days at room temperature.
Dracocephalum botryoides - NARGS seedex; germinated in 6 days at room temperature.
>>>> Interesting that those alliums germinated without stratification.
I was planning on giving Allium meteoricum a cold treatment when one popped up. But as I note, it was only one out of 15, which probably indicates an anomaly.
A few years ago I had germinated Alium sikkimense with only warm temperatures too. Identification of the resulting blooming plants were verified by Mark. While I didn't get as good germination percentage this time, almost every seed come up within 2.5 weeks in the first batch.
Also, from the same batch of Allium sacculiferum seed from Mark McD: 17 out of 20 seeds emerged within 3 weeks at 70F; when given a 40-70 regime, only one out of 20 seed came up.
And yes, the Scutellaria alpina was indeed a surprise!
It's really useful to be keeping those records, as you've noted. I haven't started many alliums from seed and I tend to assume, from the few I have started, that stratification might be needed - obviously not!
More bad, fuzzy seedling pics...
Campanula crenulata - Holubec seed from China (Haizi Shan, Sechuan); stratified for 4 weeks at which time they started sprouting in the cold/dark.
Arabis lemmonii - Alplains seed; stratified for 6 weeks, germination after 4 days at room temperature.
Arnica lessingii - NARGS seedex, collected Alaska, Gold Ridge, Juneau (thank you, Donor #51!);germinated at room temperature
Erigeron humilis - germinated in 4 days at room temperature
Androsace fedtschenkoi - stratified for 7 weeks, then germinated strongly after 7 days at room temperature. Given that this a biennial/annual similar to A. septentrionalis, I'm guessing now that it may not have needed stratification at all(?)
Incarvillea zhongdianensis - germinated after 15 days at room temperature.
Some more updates and some new ones:
Matthiola trojana - germinated in 12 days at room temperature
Oxytropis campanulata - germinated in 3 days at room temperature after scarifying.
A burgeoning potful of Helichrysum basalticum - germinated in 30 days at room temperature; a Sani Pass native that is successfully grown at the Denver Botanical Garden, so worth a try here.
Soroseris rosularis - seed from Holubec (collected: China - Xinduqiao, Sechuan); stratified for 4 weeks and started germinating in the cold/dark.
Convolvulus tragacanthoides - update; I ended up with one of these; if I could do it over again, I'd scarify the seed, which worked very well for Convolvulus nitidus (following the advice from Stephanie F.).
Dianthus myrtinervius - stratified for 4 weeks; started germinating after 3 days at room temperature
Androsace spinulifera - stratified, started sprouting in the cold/dark after 4 weeks.
Michauxia campanuloides - germinated at room temperature.
Erigeron linearis update:
Plantago nivalis - I'm looking forward to having these furry things in the garden!
Hyoscyamus pusillis - ditto! Hope this one stays fairly small.
My first garden meant for Fort Collins, CO, my new home. Propagation began a few months ago. All sorts of stuff; seed and cuttings
Sedums, semps, and a bunch of alpines that needed no strat.
Recently I found the following had amazingly germinated at cold temperatures. The warmest temperature was probably 10C due to a heater running during the day reaching pots on higher shelves. Most of these were on the floor and germinated with alternating 0 - 4C temps!
|Alstroemeria ligtu hybrid cold x 10 wks started to germinate @ 4C|
|Asclepias cordifolia wild seed 8 wks cold started to germinate in cold|
|Aubrieta gracilis 4 wks @ 4-10C; germinated in cold|
|Campanula aff pulla 6 wks cold germinated in cold @ 4C|
|Campanula incurva 6wks cold germinated in cold @ 4C|
|Draba bryoides in cold x 6 wks germinated started at 4C|
|Edraianthus serbicus 5 wks cold germinated at 4 -10C|
|Linaria alpina mix 5 wks cold germinated at 4 - 10C|
|Penstemon barrettiae OT in GH Nov, Dec; to 4C on January 2; Germination @ 4-10C in 4 wks.|
|Phlox colubrina 8 wks cold germinated well @4C.|
|Primula beesiana given OT x 5 wks brought to 4C germinated in 3 wks|
|Pulsatilla alpina ssp apiifolia after 8 wks cold started to germinate in cold|
|Pulsatilla halleri ssp grandis after 8wks cold started to germinated in cold|
Interestingly also, is that I can't bring the germinated pots to temperatures of 20-25C! They show signs of heat distress. So back they go to a cold room.
Campanula thyrsoides, 17 days after sowing. Room temp, unheated propagator, indirect light. Thanks Lori,
You're welcome! Glad they're doing well for you.
A few more from last weekend:
Salvia kuznetzovii - stratified for 2 months, germinated in 3 days at room temperature.
Hylomecon japonicum - stratified for 2 months; germinated in 3 days at room temperature.
Salvia daghestanica - stratified for 2 months; germinated in 2 days at room temperature.
Anemone narcissiflora - stratified for 7 weeks; germinated in 5 days at room temperature.
Campanula betulifolia - stratified; germinating in the cold/dark at 7 1/2 weeks.
Balsamorhiza rosea - stratified for 6 weeks as per Alplains instructions; germination in 2 days at room temperature.
Campanula piperi - stratified (Alplains said 8 weeks); germination in cold/dark at 5 weeks.
Nardostachys jatamansi - stratified; germinated in cold/dark at 3 weeks.
Anemone tetonensis - stratified for 7 weeks; germinated in about 5 days at room temperature.
Oxytropis multiceps - scarified; germinated in 5 days at room temperature.
Astragalus candolleanus - scarified; germinated in 5 days at room temperature.
Campanula excisa - yes I did dump the whole packet in there! Stratified for 6 weeks, then germinated at 7 days at room temperature.
Probably the coolest seedling I will grow this year, at 9 weeks old:
Erigeron compositus Mt. Adams Dwarf
Very pretty baby Rick
Cute thing, Rick. Does it sting?
It's actually quite soft.
Freshly harvested Corydalis seeds. Again, I missed most of them....
Corydalis solida and Corydalis nobilis
Freshly harvested Corydalis seeds. Again, I missed most of them....
Corydalis solida and Corydalis nobilis
You are better than me anyway, I miss all of them . . . . .
Seeds of Rheum nobile (Rheum Sikkimensis) obtained through Plant World Seeds from Nepal:
germination in 9 or 10 days at 20 degrees Celsius in moist vermiculite.
Rick-----I think that is great that you are documenting more plant germination data for us.
I document what I do myself, but don't keep track of what others have found----until I wind up with seeds!