Seeking Pseudotrillium rivale forma reticulatum

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Jeddeloh
Title: Member
Joined: 2010-05-02
Seeking Pseudotrillium rivale forma reticulatum

Hi,
I know this is a major long shot but I'd love to get my hot little hands on a piece of rhizome or even seed of a heavily silver veined form of Pseudotrillium (Trillium) rivale. I know someone who has managed to tissue culture trilliums so you can see where I'm going with this..... If you've got this baby and are overseas seed is no problem-I have a seed import permit.

I have (if it hasn't drowned) Pseudotrillium rivale "Purple Heart" or Trillium kurabayashii seed (not ripe yet) to trade. I can also most likely scare up some Trillium ovatum seed later this summer.

Jan Jeddeloh in Portland, Oregon where it looks like we're going to have another (third year in a row) lousy wet summer.

Mark McD
Title: Moderator
Joined: 2009-12-14

Hi Jan, at risk of diverting attention to your question, but focus instead on the root of the taxonomy, I'm curious about the use of "Pseudotrillium rivale" versus Trillium rivale.  The Flora of North America uses Trillium rivale (no recognition of this new-fangled Pseudotrillium), and The Plant List gives a 3-star confidence level for Trillium rivale and cites Pseudotrillium as a synonym.  Where does the Pseudotrillium name come from, when the presiding taxonomic references don't recognize it?

Judging from this wikipedia entry, it was a proposed separation in 2002, but it doesn't seem to be adopting by the major taxonomic references even to this date.

Mark McDonough
Massachusetts, USA, near the New Hampshire border USDA Zone 5
antennaria at aol.com
 

Tim Ingram
Title: Member
Joined: 2011-04-27

Mark - definitely with you on that! it seems an odd and foolish name to give to a plant which is so obviously a Trillium. Does nothing to clarify things.

Jan - in the UK Kevin Hughes is one of the most respected and knowlegeable growers of trilliums and showed some amazing silver veined forms at a talk to us a year or two back. He must collect seed from his plants. (Kevin Hughes Plants - see 'The Plantfinder').

Dr. Timothy John Ingram
Faversham, Kent, UK
I garden in a relatively hot and dry region (for the UK!), with an annual rainfall of around 25", winter lows of -10°C and summer highs of 30°C.
 

Jeddeloh
Title: Member
Joined: 2010-05-02

Actually, I debated which name to use for my request and decided on Pseudotrillium because that's what the NARGS seed exchange lists it under.  Really, go look for yourself.  I was afraid if I posted my request under Trillium rivale I'd get a bunch of posts, "This plant is now considered Pseudotrillium rivale........" implying I really ought to keep up with current nomenclature!

This is another case where the splitting is done based on genetic analysis (shades of dodecatheon anyone?).  The best quickie explanation and link to sources is in this article: http://www.botanicalgarden.ubc.ca/potd/2008/05/pseudotrillium_rivale.php

I'm not one who is inclined to get my knickers in twist over nomenclature one way or the other.  I like to grow and admire pretty plants no matter what they're called. I'd rather just garden......

Thank you Tim for you suggestion of Kevin Hughes Plants.  It can't hurt to shoot him a email.  He may be able to tell me if he was able to develop a true breeding strain of heavily veined plants. 

Claire Cockcroft has generously offered me a seedling with quite a lot of silver venation on her next trip to Portland. 

Jan

Jan Jeddeloh, Portland, Oregon, USA, Zone 8.  Rainy winters (40 inches or 1 meter) and pleasant dry summers which don't start until July most years!

Tim Ingram
Title: Member
Joined: 2011-04-27

Good luck in your quest Jan. As someone who has loved science all my life and also gardening there is a bit of a dilemma about name changes. I suppose each needs to be considered on its own merits. But gardening wins out for me - it's much more difficult to 'see' genome sequences, and frustrating when talking to other gardeners!

Dr. Timothy John Ingram
Faversham, Kent, UK
I garden in a relatively hot and dry region (for the UK!), with an annual rainfall of around 25", winter lows of -10°C and summer highs of 30°C.
 

Mark McD
Title: Moderator
Joined: 2009-12-14

Tim wrote:

Mark - definitely with you on that! it seems an odd and foolish name to give to a plant which is so obviously a Trillium. Does nothing to clarify things.

I just tend to defer to the governing flora, such as Flora of North America for North American Trillium.  Although that said, I still refuse to agree with the bizarre lumping of Lewisia tweedyi into the genus Cistanthe, when that genus is mostly a conglomeration of former Calyptridium (Spraguea) and a couple of Calandrinia thrown in.

Mark McDonough
Massachusetts, USA, near the New Hampshire border USDA Zone 5
antennaria at aol.com
 

Lori S.
Title: Moderator
Joined: 2009-10-27

Jan wrote:

Actually, I debated which name to use for my request and decided on Pseudotrillium because that's what the NARGS seed exchange lists it under.  Really, go look for yourself.  I was afraid if I posted my request under Trillium rivale I'd get a bunch of posts, "This plant is now considered Pseudotrillium rivale........" implying I really ought to keep up with current nomenclature!

Just can't win sometimes, Jan!  :D  (Damned nomenclature anyway!!)  I'm glad you've found a lead on what you're looking for.

Lori
Calgary, Alberta, Canada - Zone 3
-30 C to +30 C (rarely!); elevation ~1130m; annual precipitation ~40 cm

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